Noam Chomsky on 911

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Noam Chomsky on 911

Postby Anonymizer » Fri May 13, 2011 9:13 am

I thought we had a thread on Noam Chomsky and a thread on 9-11 but I could find neither. Please feel free to move this post if I missed something.

Anyway.

I dug up this video of Noam Chomsky on 911 and would like to give it my analysis. So I'm just going to let the video play in the background and see what comes to mind.



In part 1 Chomsky admits that all the authoritarian power systems in the world loved 9-11. He admits governments are using 9-11 as a pretext to exploit their agenda on to the population.


In part 2 he says that it is extremely unlikely that the Bush administration knew anything about 9-11. This is where I usually start to jump up and down. So ok. Lets' hear this out. He says the Bush administration would have been insane to try anything like that. No argument from me there. He also claims that it would almost be certain that it leaked out. Hmm. I'd say that it did leak out and continues to do so till this very day but that all governments have so much to gain by covering it up that they extend every resource to make sure that it does not.

So first he proclaims that all the governments in the world have much to gain from 9-11 but then he changes his words slightly and says that if the Republican party were (the word solely is implied) responsible that all the rest of government forces would get together and expose them. This is a masterful spin because you can't argue with what he is saying. You can only argue with what he is implying. After that he spins back the other way and claims that the risk of the "Bush administration" pulling off a 9-11 is insane and implies that they would have nothing to gain by taking such a huge risk.

I love this quote from him in the video. "If you look at the evidence. anybody that knows anything about the sciences would instantly discount that evidence" . When I listen to him say that he says it as if he just disproved something by saying it. But when I stop and think about it I have to scratch my head. Can anybody honestly tell me what that means?

Here is another one. "When somebody carries out a controlled experiment at the best laboratories at the end there are lots of things that are unexplained". On and on and on without ever mentioning what he is talking about.

He finally wraps it up with. "Even if it were true, which is extremely unlikely, who cares?" I wish I knew what he was talking about but he has flip flopped back and forth so many times that I have to admit. He lost me. At this point in the video he appears to have switched to talking about conspiracy nuts. So he begins his argument by saying that governments had a lot to gain by 9-11 but then I think he switches to taking about the bush administration, that the bush administration exclusively would have been crazy to try and pull it off alone and then somehow then goes from talking about 9-11 and begins talking about conspiracy nuts in general comparing it to JFK and then ends his talk saying that this is all about is personal opinion (and not the evidence of which he never offers). I really can't argue with any of the fact he brought up. (what were they again?) And I certainly believe the man is entitled to his own personal opinion.
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Re: Noam Chomsky on 911

Postby Anonymizer » Fri May 13, 2011 12:48 pm

I hear Chomsky saying that 9/11 presented an opportunity for governments around the world to exert more control over their citizens. Bush enacted a few pieces of legislation in response to 9/11 and there's no doubt that he used the event to his advantage to push forward his agenda. All politicians take advantage of the opportunities presented to them. In fact, that's one of the most defining characteristics of being a politician.

The idea that Bush planned this event is ludicrous. I completely agree with Chomsky on this one and I believe that anyone who seriously believes that Bush was behind the 9/11 attack is drinking a little too much conspiracy theory koolaid. I'm sorry, but terrorists had the resources and they had the motivation. In fact, they ignited a bomb at the World Trade Center only a few years before this attack. Quite frankly I would have been surprised if the building remained standing after being hit by an airliner. There is nothing even slightly odd about it collapsing as it did!
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Re: Noam Chomsky on 911

Postby Anonymizer » Fri May 13, 2011 5:28 pm

I have to agree with your post except for the ending. Not even a German Luftwaffe with a bomb could have flattened one of those WTC buildings and especially not an aluminum passenger plane and anybody that believes this simply doesn't understand the physics between an aluminum plane and a concrete and steel building and has been watching too much propaganda on TV. Bush was obviously too dumb to pull off 9-11 and lacked the resources. Geez that's almost as dumb as believing it was done by some guy living in a cave! Something like that could have only been pulled off by a group of religious nut jobs that have connections in communication and many powerful influences and has infiltrated the entire united states government, the media and most of the rest of the world. Someone who controls both the right and the left political parties.
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Re: Noam Chomsky on 911

Postby Anonymizer » Fri May 13, 2011 7:26 pm

surfsteve wrote:...anybody that believes this simply doesn't understand the physics between an aluminum plane and a concrete and steel building and has been watching too much propaganda on TV.

... Geez that's almost as dumb as believing it was done by some guy living in a cave! Something like that could have only been pulled off by a group of religious nut jobs...

Wouldn't there have been a lot of jet fuel in the airliner? Didn't it just take off? Wouldn't there have also been gas in the building? What do they use for heating in skyscrapers? Couldn't there also be other properties of the building that might cause explosions?

As for religious nutjobs... yes, radical Muslims qualify and they were quite well funded from what I understand. OBL is supposed to have had a lot of money. Also there are the flight school records, etc. IMHO, any group of about a dozen reasonably intelligent and motivated people with about $100K could have pulled off the 9/11 attack. It wouldn't take anything more than that.
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Re: Noam Chomsky on 911

Postby Anonymizer » Sat May 14, 2011 12:14 pm

You are right. Jet fuel melts steel. Just take a look at these videos!!


I stand corrected!
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Re: Noam Chomsky on 911

Postby Anonymizer » Sat May 14, 2011 3:21 pm

I thought that the comment left on YouTube by a user going by 12Weasel was quite appropriate. Do you seriously think that melting steal is even relevant here? We're talking about the collapse of a building! No melting necessary for that to happen. Melting might occur in the subsequent fire, but that depends on the combustible materials and other conditions. The guy in those videos is such a (insert phrase used by 12Weasel here)!!!
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Re: Noam Chomsky on 911

Postby Anonymizer » Sun May 15, 2011 5:58 am

I thought about the stupidity of the video when I posted it. I agree with you. The video was probably faked. Everyone knows that jet fuel can easily melt steel. It's all right there in the 9-11 report. Once the steel inside the concrete melted the only thing left was for the concrete to explode from the extreme pressure generated by the media.
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Re: Noam Chomsky on 911

Postby Anonymizer » Sun May 15, 2011 3:07 pm

sandman wrote:I thought that the comment left on YouTube by a user going by 12Weasel was quite appropriate. Do you seriously think that melting steal is even relevant here? We're talking about the collapse of a building! No melting necessary for that to happen. Melting might occur in the subsequent fire, but that depends on the combustible materials and other conditions. The guy in those videos is such a (insert phrase used by 12Weasel here)!!!
:funny:

surfsteve wrote:I thought about the stupidity of the video when I posted it. I agree with you. The video was probably faked. Everyone knows that jet fuel can easily melt steel. It's all right there in the 9-11 report. Once the steel inside the concrete melted the only thing left was for the concrete to explode from the extreme pressure generated by the media.

The issue about the temperature at which steel melts seems irrelevant to me (what they call a red herring in the world of debate). It was not necessary for steel to melt for the buildings to collapse. The fact that melted steel was observed is an interesting fact, but its an anomaly that most likely can be accounted for by conditions that occurred after the collapse. To fixate on the melted steel issue is like grasping at straws in support of a crazy conspiracy theory. I subscribe to the belief that the simplest explanation is likely to be to the correct one (sometimes referred to as Occam's razor). The terrorists had the motivation and the resources to pull off the attack. For the Bush administration (or some other group connected in some way to the power structure here in the USA) to do this would require some really weird circuitous reasoning. Just because the Bush administration found a way to use the situation to its advantage doesn't mean they are responsible for the situation. As much as I despise the Bush administration, I prefer to remain rooted in the rational world and will not believe in some stupid conspiracy theory in order to justify my dislike of the Bush administration. After all, the Bush administration gave us plenty of reason to dislike them without any of this 9/11 conspiracy stuff!
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Re: Noam Chomsky on 911

Postby Anonymizer » Tue May 17, 2011 6:39 am

Speaking of Occam's Razor!
To fixate on the melted steel issue is like grasping at straws in support of a crazy conspiracy theory. I subscribe to the belief that the simplest explanation is likely to be to the correct one (sometimes referred to as Occam's razor).

BTW, this is a comedy video for those out there who have a defective sarcasm module installed in their cranial cavity! :funny:
Oh, and 9/11 is mentioned in this video and so it is quite relevant to this thread!!!
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Re: Noam Chomsky on 911

Postby Anonymizer » Wed May 18, 2011 5:15 am

I didn't realize this was a battle of stupidity. I give up you guys win. Just ignore the evidence and believe whatever you want. Bin Laden and the war on terrorism is dead, your president is honest and the recent price drop in gas will continue on forever as the economy and jobs all come back and everlasting peace occurs because your government cares about you so much. Sweet dreams!
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Re: Noam Chomsky on 911

Postby wildrose » Sat Aug 06, 2011 7:50 am

America in Decline
The amazing thing is that Congress seems to be completely unresponsive to what the majority of Americans want. It's like our representatives don't actually represent us! :mad002:
For the public, the primary domestic concern is unemployment. Under current circumstances, that crisis can be overcome only by a significant government stimulus, well beyond the recent one, which barely matched decline in state and local spending – though even that limited initiative probably saved millions of jobs.

For financial institutions the primary concern is the deficit. Therefore, only the deficit is under discussion. A large majority of the population favor addressing the deficit by taxing the very rich (72 percent, 27 percent opposed), reports a Washington Post-ABC News poll. Cutting health programs is opposed by overwhelming majorities (69 percent Medicaid, 78 percent Medicare). The likely outcome is therefore the opposite.

LINK: http://www.truth-out.org/america-decline/1312567242
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Re: Noam Chomsky on 911

Postby cactuspete » Thu May 10, 2012 8:31 am

Chomsky: Do We Have the Makings of a Real Revolution?
It's not about 911, but it is by Chomsky. Interesting read!
Unless the spirit of the last year continues to grow and becomes a major force in the social and political world, the chances for a decent future are not very high.

LINK: http://www.alternet.org/economy/155329/chomsky%3A_do_we_have_the_makings_of_a_real_revolution/
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